The People’s Tribune recently interviewed Alicia Kuhl. She and her three children are formerly homeless, and she is the president of the Santa Cruz Union of the Homeless, which is part of the California chapter of the National Union of the Homeless. In this interview, she describes how she herself became homeless, and discusses how the homeless are stigmatized by the false narrative about homelessness that is put out by some public officials and others.
People’s Tribune: Are you from the Santa Cruz area originally?
Alicia Kuhl: I was born at Valley Medical Center and I kind of grew up in Campbell, but I’ve been in the Santa Cruz area now for about 15 plus years. I didn’t grow up too far away, so it’s always kind of been a part of my life because I lived just over the hill. So I would always spend a lot of childhood time here and I always knew that I would live here when I grew up.
PT: Can you tell us how you became homeless and how you got involved with the homeless union?
AK: About five years ago I was renting a house in the Santa Cruz mountains and I came home one day and there was a demolition crew there. There were eight houses on the property that we were living at – there was one landlord house and there about eight other properties and there was a demolition crew demolishing one of the units. And I asked the landlord what was going on because the houses were kind of all in a row, and so we could see everything that was going on. And he said that he was having issues with the county and that they had begun demolishing the units. He did not tell us when we rented from him that he had an ongoing court case with the county in which he had lost, and that his units were not permitted and were not legal units for him to be charging rent for.
And he apparently had been ordered since 2013 to not rent out these units, and he was still doing so, and at the time that I was living there, they were all occupied. So it came to the time where the county was demolishing the units because he was in non-compliance. I was told that the unit that I was living in was on the list and as soon as the county got enough funding that they’d be demolishing our unit too. I asked what would happen to us. They said we’d be given only a few hours to get everything that we owned out of the unit and that we have to comply with the county, and the sheriffs and everything were out there when they were demolishing this other unit. And so basically if we didn’t comply, we could be arrested. And it really freaked me out and scared me.
So I told the landlord, I don’t think we’re going to be able to stay here. One day they’re going to just come and if I’m not here, they could demolish the unit. We asked for our deposit money back and our latest amount of rent back so that we could move. He refused that amount. We had just gotten a little bit of an insurance settlement from a car accident that wasn’t my fault that really injured my hand. And so in a pickle, I decided to use that money to buy us an RV, because I started looking for places to move to and without the money being refunded from the landlord, we were just in a bind – the rents had considerably gone up. And so I figured an RV would be the best solution for us. So we got the nicest looking RV we could and we started parking around different locations that we thought would be safe.
We originally started to park by the donut shop on the west side, and that’s when the police harassment just started. And so I had police knocking on the RV all the time, asking what we were doing, accusing us of being drug dealers. One time we parked in a location that was behind the Valero (gas station) on the west side and we were attacked in the middle of the night by some community members that were banging on our RV, screaming at us, telling us to move. It really freaked us out. And so from then on I started getting involved in local organizations and sort of just became an activist to change the narrative and to talk about people in my situation and how we’re being treated, and what we need, and things like that. So it’s just sort of evolved. It was never something I planned to do.
PT: So you helped organize the homeless union here?
AK: Yes. I was invited actually to a meeting which, if I remember right, I think it was Homeless United for Friendship and Freedom. I was told this attorney, Anthony, wanted to come and do a presentation about the union and about people standing up for themselves, things like that. And I attended that meeting and that’s when he, Anthony, kind of took to me said, you know, I have a lot of faith in you to help organize a homeless union chapter here. And it was also during the time that the Ross Camp [homeless encampment] situation was going on, so it was a good time to do this. My best friend was unfortunately living in the Ross Camp. And so I was also involved in the way people were being treated there and what was going to happen to them. And so the homeless union kind of formed around that and around those struggles. And since then we’ve tackled a number of issues.
PT: Can you give us an overview of the current situation with the unhoused in the Santa Cruz area? Do you have a sense of how many people are homeless and how many are women and children, and how many are seniors, etc.?
AK: Well we’d have to look at the Point in Time (PIT) count. Unfortunately, those are the only numbers that we actually have to let us know what the count is. I’d have to look back and see what the latest count was. I’m pretty sure that it was a little over 2000 countywide and then it was like 700 or 800 within the city limits. Not entirely sure how many are women and children or how many are disabled. I can say I know that a large amount of our homeless population is elderly and disabled. I mean, I’ve seen that with my own eyes. I’ve seen that amongst the shelter population. For women and children, I’m not entirely sure.
I never have completely trusted the PIT count, and I’m not the only one. And it’s just because the way that it’s taken, it’s an estimate. They go around and they try to estimate how many people might be in that tent or how many people they think are maybe sleeping in their vehicles. And so that’s just kind of a rough estimate, it doesn’t give the full scope of what we’re dealing with. I know that we have a lot of college students. A big thing at UC Santa Cruz has been homeless students, that’s been an outcry. And so I do know that a large number of people aren’t counted, and some people even hide due to the stigma, they don’t really want to be counted, and so they try to keep their homelessness a secret.
PT: I’ve heard that now there’s a high number of young people that are homeless.
AK: And it’s also important to note that a lot of those younger people are former foster care recipients. They come directly from the foster care system and then they’re not provided enough services. And then they end up becoming homeless adults. It’s very sad. I believe I read that it was like 40% of the homeless are people who were formerly in foster care as youths.
PT: How are people surviving? Where are they finding someplace to sleep? Where are they finding food?
AK: Good question. I know that right now, Food Not Bombs is providing the daily meal. Before Covid there were a few other locations, like the St. Francis Soup Kitchen was providing a lunch and things like that. But right now I think Food Not Bombs is the main source of food on a daily basis. People were sleeping at the Benchlands encampment for a long amount of time during a couple of years before the city chose to disperse that [in 2022]. Some of those residents went into the few shelters that the city provided. But I’m hearing right now that the overflow and all of the individuals that weren’t able to go to those locations are now in doorways, alcoves, downtown, sleeping in parking garages. There’s about 200 people in a large encampment down Highway 9.
And so people have just kind of dispersed all over the place. As far as nightly shelter, one of the biggest complaints that we’ve had recently is the city has not opened a 24-hour emergency shelter or warming center during these atmospheric river storms that we’re having. The only thing being provided right now locally in town is being ran by the Santa Cruz Free Guide and it’s at Depot Park. And somehow last night they were able to fit 49 people in there, but that wasn’t the original number. It was like less than 30 that they were saying that they had space for. And so it’s just really inadequate. It’s only open from 8 PM to 8 AM. So we’ve kind of been rallying around the fact that the city needs to open something with a larger capacity and something that’s open for 24 hours because this rain is not just at nighttime. And we did lose somebody a few months back. We lost somebody due to weather, right outside Housing Matters [a local operation that provides some housing and services to the homeless]. So it’s not like it’s not life-threatening. It is.
PT: How do you see the history of the relationship between the homeless and the local community, and between the homeless and the city and county governments? Has that been better in the past and got worse? Or has it always been kind of rocky?
AK: I feel like it’s always been a little bit rocky. There’s unfortunately been a narrative surrounding homelessness that is stigmatizing – you know, a narrative that people deserve the situation that they’ve gotten themselves into, or that it’s all drugs and alcohol and substance abuse is the reason that they’re out there, or that they don’t want to follow rules. I’ve heard that even from some of our leaders, and I think that that mentality stops what needs to happen. You know, it stops the services and it stops the assistance, because people feel like the homeless don’t deserve it. And it’s just so unfortunate because in my experience, when people have all of their basic needs met, it’s safer for everyone. You know, crime goes down, people are safer. It becomes more of a community environment. And unfortunately, I haven’t seen the city and county leaders try to get us to that place. I feel like they’re constantly looking at forms of criminalization instead of assistance and services. Even in the past few years, they’ve talked about camping bans and RV ordinances and they’ve talked about those things more than they’ve talked about, “we need more shelter, we don’t have a warming center.” You know, what are we going to do in an environmental disaster to save lives? They’ve not focused on those things. Instead they’ve focused on criminalization, and the efforts that they have put forth for shelter just haven’t been enough. And I question the amount of money that’s being spent and, you know, we’ve asked for audits too on how they’re spending the money because it doesn’t seem like things are getting done the way that they should and a lot of money’s being spent.
And they’re talking about getting more. I just heard a plan where they’re asking for even more money, and I don’t understand how they can just keep asking for more money. And we have people on the streets during these atmospheric rivers. Why don’t they save a little bit of money from these funds, these grants, wherever they’re getting it from, for hotel vouchers in the middle of an atmospheric river, you know what I mean?
PT: It seems like they don’t want the homeless here at all, period. It interferes with their development plans.
AK: Yeah, that’s the way I feel. And it’s really sad because there are local residents [among the homeless]. There was a study done not long ago that said that something like 70% of our local homeless have lived here for many years. They’re not just travelers who came here. They are citizens who have lived here and lost their housing here.
PT: Do the various local organizations of the homeless in different parts of California communicate with each other on a regular basis or connect in some way?.
AK: So that’s the reason why we have a union, is that we connect with different unions and, and talk about different ways to handle these struggles. I have noticed a kind of a blueprint, if you want to call it that, that cities use, like I was describing how they say, you know, “people don’t want services, people don’t want to follow rules, these encampments are causing a health and safety issue.” I’ve heard sort of the same pattern from different cities and it’s like a justification and excuse to not provide services. I have heard that from many different cities. It’s the same thing and same tactics that they use.
And we do share a lot of the same struggle. What’s happening in Santa Cruz is definitely not isolated to Santa Cruz. I know San Francisco just recently was able to be successful, at least temporarily, with a lawsuit banning sweeps across the city because they lack shelter capacity. And so it was based on the Martin vs. Boise decision that you can’t sweep encampments and disallow people to sleep in public areas or camp and survive if you lack shelter capacity. And so that’s something we’ve kind of been looking at. The circumstances are a little different for us because San Francisco was actually writing tickets to people, and so they were very much openly violating Martin vs. Boise. We don’t have the same circumstances here in Santa Cruz, but I would really like to get to a point where leaders in Santa Cruz recognize that they lack shelter capacity and they stop sweeping people and harassing people.
PT: Are the sweeps and the harassment here a pretty regular, ongoing thing right now?
AK: Oh yeah. It’s been an ongoing thing. The police move people from public places knowing that they don’t have anywhere else to go. I’ve witnessed them [police] stand there in a posture, in a stance, you know, two or three, four of them, and they’ll just stand there until the homeless person leaves that location.
PT: I saw this letter that Keith McHenry from Food not Bombs put online the other day that he got from the chief of police telling Food not Bombs that they can’t use that city garage space here that they had been using during rainstorms to feed people, and the city didn’t offer any other place they could go to feed people.
AK: Yes, and then if you listened to their justifications, it was like all kind of made-up nonsense, like people can’t park in the parking garage because the homeless are interfering, there’s substance abuse, it’s just all really blown out of proportion. It’s just people eating, and the parking garage is largely unused. It’s just ridiculous, and hateful. They used it to really paint the homeless as criminals. But that’s what they do, and that’s what feeds that narrative in the minds of our community. It partially comes from our own police department and our own city saying those things and putting out that message. I mean our own police chief, not the current one, but the previous one, Andy Mills, he put out on his Twitter something about a documentary about homelessness in Seattle just completely painting the homeless as you know, drug users that were ruining Seattle. And, and he tweeted that. He very much wanted to paint the narrative, like, you know, if we don’t do something we could end up like that.
PT: What do you think can be done to change the narrative about the homeless in the minds of the housed community locally? It seems like it would help a lot if some kind of broader base of support for the homeless among the local housed people could be built.
AK: Definitely. I think definitely education and anything that lets people know what the plight is because I think that when people are in their houses, and they’re doing their jobs every day and they’re taking care of their families, they oftentimes don’t know this is even going on. So I think just bringing the awareness, because you can’t be compassionate if you’re not even aware that it’s going on, for one thing. And then just constantly changing the narrative, you know, talking about the root causes of homelessness, and steering away from blaming people who have substance abuse problems and things like that. And calling out facts, like the percentage of homeless that you see on the streets that are right there in front of your face that might be doing something that makes you feel uncomfortable, that’s the 1% – that’s the visible side of homelessness. But homelessness is very broad – you know, there’s people living in cars, and so on. Even under the federal guidelines of homelessness, if you’re bunked up, you can even have a roof over your head and still be considered homeless if you lack shelter of your own that’s, accommodating and if you have seven or eight roommates and, and it’s not sustainable. I forget the exact wording, but you know, the guideline on homelessness includes a lot of different things and I know people like to focus on just that 1%, but if you look at the whole picture, it’s really eye-opening.
PT: I think the Poor People’s Campaign estimates there’s something between eight and 10 million people homeless nationwide.
AK: Yeah, definitely. I think so. And it’s definitely growing. I mean, even people in other countries – just look at Turkey, they have an earthquake and now they have millions of homeless people. It’s just sad.
PT: How do you see the solution to homelessness long term?
AK: The solution to homelessness is housing. I think that’s the simplest answer. I know a lot of studies have been done to say it’s the cheapest solution as well. And we might have to look at, you know, opening our minds to different forms of housing. I know that with Project Room Key, the city had a considerable amount of money for hotels for a specific amount of time, but other cities chose to use some of that money to purchase hotels. And so people were able to be at least permanently housed in those hotel rooms. They became like studios. And so, you know, we can open our minds to providing different types of housing, but everyone should be sheltered. Nobody should be dying on the streets. And I don’t think it’s that farfetched either. I think it’s totally attainable. I mean we can start right there. We can start with available empty hotel rooms.
PT: The city says some percentage of affordable housing is being built here in these new developments, but it seems like a small percentage.
AK: It is a small percentage. Every time they do these giant developments, it’s something like maybe, you know, 10 units, and they’re not even for the demographic that we’re speaking of – they’re for people who can afford almost market rate, just slightly under. It’s not for people who are say, disabled and have a social security check. It’s not income-based by any means. Vouchers and certain apartments go by 30% of your income. You know, that’s how people can kind of survive who have a social security check. And so it’s exactly what you said – it’s big developments that only include a few units. Housing Matters is working on a permanent supportive living building. But that’s going to be I think for under 200 people. And it’s also the most expensive type of housing, permanent supportive, because it comes with lifetime case management and property managers on site. It’s just really expensive. And so with that being the only unit and it’s not even built yet, you know, it’s not looking good.
PT: And so do you think getting the word out, getting the real stories of homelessness out there can help?
AK: Yes, I think the more we talk about this, the more we tell the truth, the more we can just be honest about everything that’s happening, you know, maybe we can get more support.
Bob Lee is a professional journalist, writer and editor, and is co-editor of the People’s Tribune, serving as Managing Editor. He first started writing for and distributing the People’s Tribune in 1980, and joined the editorial board in 1987.
